gnatb
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Post by gnatb on Feb 23, 2011 4:49:13 GMT -5
Just started looking at this game a few weeks ago, but here's a few random suggestions I have:
1. Be cool if stats other than the first 3 (i.e. not happiness, sanity, health) are only be able to go from 0 to 100 (i.e. no negatives or over 100) innately. Worn equipment, however, would be able to take the values above or below the "natural" 0-100 limits. (in particular, above) and the current value of the stat would read something like 55 (+15), meaning 55 innate, and 15 from equipment.
2. Clothing should have a "nympho" stat. If a girl's nympho is within a certain threshold (10 above or below?) of that stat, the nympho will gain a point of nympho per day. If below the stat at all, the girls happiness will go down a certain # of points per period, and the outfit will only be partially effective in granting it's bonus. If significantly below, sanity will go down as well.
3. Girls should keep some sort of record of how much they have "earned" - how much they have cost for "room and board". Every 100 days or whatever, If a girls net profit amount is above a certain level she is deemed self sufficient and "freed". Insane girls will never be freed, and girls that are in love with the player will decline their freedom. Freed girls would be one of the primary means by which a player would move up in rank as a trainer. (girls that decline also count towards promotion. Insane ones do not) Sold girls do NOT count. Note: Earning wouldn't neccessarily be the actual coin in service/goods that girl has earned. Every action would have some sort of value based on how skilled they are. So a girl "cleaning" all the time would be "Earning", especially if a skilled maid.
4. Rename the sex classes and make them actual classes that can be learned through practice. Classes would be "Male", "Female", and possibly "Futanari". Abilities in those classes would be indicitive of how good the slave is at pleasuring members of that gender. The girls "default" gender class would be her actual personal gender preference, and unchangeable. But let's face it. They're slaves. Doesn't really matter if they wouldn't particularly seek out that gender, they can be trained o regardless. Slaves that are futanari themselves would have the same classes available, but the skills in them would be named differently. (Note: If Futanari is a 3rd class, and not just somehow averaging the two, then the number of classes would need to be increased to allow for a whore to actually master all the genders, as advertised...) When calculating "whoring" type earnings, all the genders would be added together to modify how much is earned. A girl who has all 3 maxed and no whoring skill would earn about as much as a girl who just has whoring and 1 gender skill maxed. A girl who has all 3 maxed along with whoring would be one of, if not the, best money maker in the game.
5. Love. Other than the potion, I've yet to see a slave fall in love. A girl should have a chance at falling in love with the player every time the two have sex if the girl is very happy, her lust is over 50, and the player is of the appropriate gender preference of the slave, (i.e. her current "default" sex class). If the player was the one who took her virginity the first time, there will be an added bonus to all future checks. If she fullfills all the requirements THE first time it will be almost guaranteed.
6. Can swear a girl to celibacy at the church (for $$). This would freeze lust at 0, remove all sex classes she has (including default, the *only* way to get rid of default). and possibly replace the default with some sort of religious "celibate" class (nun?). A Celibate girl can only love the player if they have *never* had sex. (check to fall in love during every chat session in place of sex?) If/when she has sex (again?) the type of sex will set her (new) gender preference and replace the class in her default gender slot as such, with *severe* impact to sanity and happiness.
7. Lust. Regardless of how high a slaves Lust is, they shouldn't go insane/unhappy as long as they are "serviced" once that day. (maybe really high would require twice per day). < 50 lust, penetrative sex should cause them unhappiness.
8. Combat classes. You should be able to train a girl in combat at the arena (for $$). When you train a girl in a combat class, you pick 1 (or more) of the girls existing classes that the combat class will be based off. i.e. if a 4 class system, a "siren" class may be based off musician and whoring, while a "succubus" class would only be based on whoring. Whereas a "blade dancer" class might be based on musician and blacksmith. "Samurai" might require blacksmith and fletching. "Sex mage" or whatever could require male, female, and futa. "arch priestess" could require celibacy, musician, faith healing. Etc. The maximum limit to all the combat skills would be the minimum of the related classes learned %. If the slave "forgets" one of the prerequisite classes, then that would drop ALL the combat skills to 0 until such time as the class is relearned. There would be one basic combat class that would be based on no class. Not every combination of "normal" classes would have a special class and the special class that a combo of other classes DOES result in would be indicated before selection is confirmed. *every* individual "utility" class (with the possible exception of gender classes) would have a corresponding combat class. (i.e. "Minotaurette training" or some such for cowgirl.) Note: Training doesn't increase the abilities (only actual fighting/training by assistants will) Training at the arena is only a way to select the combat class to learn. (I'm sorry, I don't particularly like the "tiering" concept posted in the other thread on combat classes, as with the limited class slots, it largely forces combatants to be pure combatants, not forcing a mixture of combatant & non combatant classes.)
9. Primes are more unique. When you go into the AH, if a girl is rolled as a prime, then it does a check to make sure it isn't a girl the player already has a prime version of. For certain combat classes a particular prime may not need all the prerequisite classes.
10. Male and Futa trainers. (or perhaps the ability to specify that the magically gifted trainers will take on male or futa forms, or talismans/scrolls that have that effect?). Needed to train the girls on how to please members of that gender.
11. When you "forget" a class, if you take the lotus to remember it, it should (assuming it doesn't) start back up where you left it. (maybe have improved/more expensive lotus this ability?)
Think that's pretty much everything, other than some art critiques... (mainly for the proposed paperdoll body types, I think the "curvy" body type looks more like steatopygia than "curvy". Maybe my definitions off, but I've always understood "curvy" to be "curvy" all over, not just enormous butt/hips.)
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Post by milkyboon on Feb 23, 2011 6:06:53 GMT -5
I like no. 3 4 6 and 8~!
I never had a girl fall in love with my character so Im not sure with no.5.
About no.9 how about, only prime can achieve certain class?
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Post by missinglynx on Feb 23, 2011 17:23:44 GMT -5
Re #3: I'm not a particularly huge fan of girls automagically going free, or even given the option to decline going free. It seems to run counter to the purpose of the game. I'm the possessive type, especially after I've spent X number of days maxing out her stats, I would be mightily upset if I hit next shift and the computer told me 'Bessie is now a perfect cowgirl! You have set her free!' I'd view that, honestly, as a big waste of time and (in-game) money. Also, I think a trainer who is forever letting his slaves go would probably decrease in rank, not increase. Re #5: There is an extremely slim chance for a girl to fall in love if her happiness is perfectly maxed out already. I don't think lust should be involved. Re #11: I don't think the Lotus works that. It only allows you to give your girl a chance to start training a class she had previously declined, not erase a class she's already started. And the way I understand it, the 'curvy' model is flat chested because breasts are an additional layer (and thus customiseable). You won't be stuck with an A cup on a curvy girl (and there was some talk about letting players customise which breast sizes will and/or are likely to show up on slaves, too).
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Post by docclox on Feb 23, 2011 17:33:50 GMT -5
Re #3: I'm not a particularly huge fan of girls automagically going free, or even given the option to decline going free. Agreed. I don't have a problem if trainers have the option to free a girl, or to allow her to earn her freedom. Just so long as it goes somewhere I won't click on it by accident.
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gnatb
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Post by gnatb on Feb 23, 2011 23:50:31 GMT -5
re: #3 It's based on the backstory of otherworld from the classes thread. "The main reason for slavery is to keep the large immigrant population from starving. As such if a slave can prove that they are skilled enough to feed themselves, then they can each year of enslavement take a test to become free. Of course some slaves refuse, those in love or insane. Some testers can be bribed. And I'm thinking some slaves become mute at bad times. Not sure how this will work out. But that means that some slave trainers are more like teachers while some are evil bastards." otherworldtoday.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=bible&action=display&thread=53So based on this, a trainer who is in fact creating productive & self supporting members of socieity, (i.e. presumably fulfilling the entire purpose of the slavery system) should be advancing in the ranks. If you want to keep a girl, get her to love you, (hence more obvious/easy to get her to love you) or break her. Possibly adding a bribery option to the "testing", as well as something like temporary insanity (according to description, caused by marijuana?) also preventing passing. re: 5. The idea is to make falling in love with you less random/more controlled. (in part to make it easier to "keep" slaves) Only reason lust is involved is due to #7, that being that sex (the suggested trigger) is only enjoyable/desireable to the girl if her lust is > 50. I'm considering 50 the "neutral point". Above 50 they want sex, below 50 they don't. And a girl isn't gonna love you if you're raping her. But if you're satisfying her itch? re: curvy. I understand that, but curvy isn't even just breasts and hips/butt. That would then just be a well endowed woman with steatopygia. "Curvy" is arms, legs, waist, etc. Overall curvy. I'd assume that just making the hips/butt real big is going to be requiring individual body clothing parts for that layer, so shouldn't change the number of images needed anyways, I'd assume.
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Post by flagnine1 on Feb 24, 2011 1:12:08 GMT -5
for number 3 the slave test is set during a set time of year thus you can control it better. You would gain guild rep by selling the slaves as they can see the work you have done during the time she was in your care. That said you would also gain it by letting your slave take the test as they can see the progress then as well.
Number 5 I see them falling in love as rare unless certain outside factors are added in. Like your character having a perk or skill charming that makes it easier. Or you slave having a status like masochist and you "punish" her a lot. Or you drug her (current best method).
as for the others
1 I agree with you and have mentioned it before. 2 Agree with you 4 both arguments have merit. maybe a generic sex class with skills give, take, and advanced (foreplay, masturbation, tit and hand jobs, and fingering). 6 neat idea I like it. 8 I personally like the system for now. the only time the choice between combat class or support class is gonna become an issue is when your going for a combo class and if that's the case you tend to have other girls available to fill the gaps.
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gnatb
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Post by gnatb on Feb 25, 2011 2:01:09 GMT -5
Yep, think backstory says the test is once a year, but IIRC a year is 400 days and I'd argue that's way too long between tests for gameplay purposes. 1/4 year (100 days) or 1/8th year (50 days) would probably play better. so day 50/100/150/etc. or day 100/200/300 etc. (the player starts off freed from one of the tests, so presumably day 0 is a test day)
And I guess I see selling a slave (in the AH) as sorta giving up on the slave, or even going for money over actually accomplishing the job. i.e. the "evilish" route. I would say that handing in a slave (for a quest) should sorta be like having her pass the test though, so guild faction should usually be part of the reward, unless it's obviously a depraved/not really making her a benefit to society quest of somesort. (i.e. the neko maid & cook quests would give guild faction, the 2 virgin twins wouldn't). but then the monetary/item reward should be significantly better for the "depraved" quests for the amount of work required..
(that being said, there's always the possibility of some sort of "evil" guild that you only gain faction with BY doing depraved quests/selling the girls instead of finishing their training...)
Additionally, there's the gameplay-side reward factor. When you sell the slave, you're already getting the money for the sale. When a girl passes the test, your only reward would be the guild rep. So the guild rep has to be significantly better than if you just sold her. To the point where selling her would be basically worthless for guild rep, just like graduating her is worthless for profit. One of the options shouldn't give both, or there's no real point in the other option. Unless there's something like a small payment for successfully graduating, and then an equally relatively small guild rep for selling. So the options are still "balanced". (and note: The whole getting the guild rep *and* still keeping her from love should be offset by what should be a relatively harder task of getting her to fall in love with you... and it should be a task. (and probably should mean you didn't make as much money off her... perhaps whoring her out reduces the odds? Having her work 'till she's in the negative?)
Guess we're gonna have to disagree on how common the love thing is though. I see it as something that would be pretty frequent. (Stockholm syndrome doesn't even require particularly good treatment, and that's something I'm suggesting should be neccessary)
And on the gameplay side of things, if love actually takes on important gameplay aspects, (i.e. it's the way a "good" trainer keeps a girl), then it has to be something that can be accomplished by the user through gameplay means, not merely a low-odds triumph over the RNG. (and the potion thing is back on the evil track, I'd argue. Other than the one you get as a tutorial on what "love" is, I'd say there shouldn't be an "instant love" item. The "evil" trainer should be breaking any slave he wants to keep, or doping/bribing so they simply fail) 'Course, could also perhaps be tied to the players guild rep. A "good" trainer is more likely to have his slaves fall in love with him or somesuch. Anyways, a player making all the right moves should be almost guaranteed to have the girl fall in love with him by the time it's test time. (and, again, they should be pretty proactive moves. Thinking about it, I think my initial suggestion is still too easy. Possibly throw in each time whoring or each time they drop to - health permanently decreases the odds of love occuring?)
You like the way combat classes work now where each girl has a set combat class? (at least, from what I can tell it's set. Each girl of the same archetype I've seen always gets the same one) That seems so... boring. The other combat classes thread idea isn't too terribly different from my suggestion though, about the only difference is what the combat class(es) are based on. The other thread bases the combat class on somehow combining two other combat classes, whereas this idea a gal only ever has 1 combat class, which is based on combining non-combat classes. I just think with a 10 slave limit (which I understand is some hard set limit that's hard to get around), and the number of jobs/classes being proposed, there WON'T be enough other girls available to "fill the gaps".
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Post by flagnine1 on Feb 25, 2011 2:56:07 GMT -5
First the closer you put the tests together the harder they should be to pass or the more it would cost to bribe the judges. On that note certain classes or trees should be banned from passing such as the farm animal tree. As they have little to no potential to be self sufficient in society. I believe the same should be true of whore, true she can make a living on her own, but she doesn't actually have a future until her T2 branches.
For guild rep you should acquire it for every thing you do. Some things might net you a negative return. Once you go up in guild rank then certain actions should stop giving guild rank. selling a half trained T1 slave is not an accomplishment any more.
As for love, I'll admit I'm an evil bastard when playing these games. So I don't really care much about the love mechanic. But I believe that redcape suggested a way for trainers to choose certain attributes at the beginning of the game to add to replay on it. One of those should raise your chance to have slaves fall for you. Also as I mentioned before there should be a way for your PC to learn a skill to make falling in love easier.
For combat I asked daisy about it on the chat tuesday and daisy said they didn't know what was up with it yet. But I like the current 6 trees (warrior, martial artist, rogue, mage, cleric, and alchemist) idea posted under classes with maybe the primes getting there own special trees. Considering you can only take 2 slaves with you to combat you only need max 3 slaves for combat, leaving you 7 rooms available to train others. One of which is probably a maid. But I think combat was designed training wise to either be specialized in or be late game. And some of the combo classes are split combat and support like the Alice class is maid warrior combo. But I don't feel you should be able to get everything in one play through, especially some of the more advanced stuff like T3 classes.
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gnatb
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Post by gnatb on Feb 26, 2011 2:33:51 GMT -5
Don't quite agree on the certain classes being "prohibited" as such... mainly that I'd argue to be a full "cowgirl" should require some variety of insanity. (think there is an insane: cowgirl type effect already suggested?) And said insanity would prevent successful testing, not merely being in the cowgirl class. If a "sane" girl that can still sell her... uhm.. product for enough profit to make a livelihood she should be capable of "graduating".
And sure, maybe the default "room and board" per day is approx equal to what a basic whore earns. (which is pretty much what the whore description states) So a simple whore would pretty much be stuck at "0", or work her way out *very* slowly.
As for combat, to be honest, I was thinking there would be sorta arenas or whatever where you could have a full party of slaves fight, or even do a "dungeon" with you and 3 slaves. And of course, with all the different combat classes available, I see the slaves as being far more customizeable in their abilities than you or the trainers, so with a large possible roster of combat slaves there could be an element of strategy in bringing the right slaves combat styles into the dungeon. Maybe some dungeons a "sex mage" would be completely useless, but in others they'd completely own. Allowing a larger roster of available combat types would allow for more options in party makeup, and thus more strategy needed in planning for the different dungeons. Whereas having to completely untrain and retrain the (same?) girls, and then untrain and retrain back to do different dungeons would just be annoying.
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Post by darkbringer on Mar 3, 2011 3:24:54 GMT -5
Not related to the current conversation (since this is the "Random Suggestion" thread) but I have a writing suggestion:
I noticed that with the discussion in the Mizuki Kanajo quest they allowed for different responses that the player can make based, essentially on their (your) personality and I'd like to see more of this done with the dialogues. Reason being is that because of how many writers are working on their own scenes and quests we have a lot of different personalities and styles, not a bad thing just a fact, and that can cause inconsistencies with how some players want to play the game.
For example, the laugh maniacally option, from the Mizuki Kanajo (M.K.) quest, caught my attention as something that may not be suitable for a Master who just previously went to see the Duke in the Raising Royalty (R.R.) quest under the same language/tone THAT writer intended. To offset this, flashnovice edited in a second option to simply "smile knowingly" with a second set of dialogue for M.K. that fit better, though still not completely perfect (in my opinion), with the more noble tone written in the R.R. quest. But then someone else could then write a third option that, indeed, did follow consistency perfectly for M.K. and R.R. Likewise, there could be additional dialogues for R.R. for a more menacing Master than was originally written (granted there are options to be offered compensation for your services already) to better match the maniacal laugh option of M.K.
So to summarize better, I'm suggesting a kind of dialogue wheel (like in Mass Effect/Dragon Age) to better flesh out the player's personality, but it would take a lot more work on each scene to make it all fit. This is also assuming IF the dialogue options go beyond 2 choices like they do now.
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Post by catsfight on Mar 3, 2011 9:00:33 GMT -5
1# which state? what do you suggest?
2# not sanity, but I think the obedience and happiness would be influenced
type. within the limits earns points of obedience and happiness if less... will lose points
3# freed girls. I think it would be with natives.
slaves. you are the owner happy or not. but you may receive from visit seen some good buyer offers a good price that for her and best of all without having to pay the auction house (only some government rate)
No it would rank, but money.
free a slave can give a rank of sociability (you're a good man ^ ^)
4# not like
5# meresse attention to everything she fall in love.
date; sex; obedience; happiness; attention(conversation)...
will be tricky in this game. but in makerslaver you kiss and fuck to give love points and after accepting her love. she has complete love for you.
fallen in love would reduce the sales price of the slave
if she loves you can be against its sale
6# unlike
7# when you have 30 years of married you will know...
high lust should make them are masturbasem without permission instead follow the order (lost obedience)
8# I think combat should be what the girl is better. not train a talented archer in sword combat ... it will be good, but not be the best.
9#~11# no comments
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mrx
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Post by mrx on Mar 3, 2011 10:59:33 GMT -5
Not related to the current conversation (since this is the "Random Suggestion" thread) but I have a writing suggestion: *SNIP* You make an entirely valid point, Darkbringer. After reading through a couple of the other proposed quests in the "Writers Wanted" forum, as well as having written the R.R. quest, I can see the difference in tone between each of the writers. Like you, I'm all for choice, and Bioware games are a great inspiration for anyone looking for great stories and the ability to choose (I'm really stoked for The Old Republic). Unfortunately, trying to rein in the story to create a uniform dialog system with 6 choices per encounter might be a nightmare, especially given that the community is helping to fuel the writing. My quest isn't too long, but it's still taken several hours to get it to the point where I'm happy with it. Adding 4 more dialog choices and weaving the story to encompass them and whatever repercussions they present would be a headache, to say the least. That said, I have no problem with going back and adding in more dialog to account for multiple personalities approaching the story, however, others might not have the time or drive to edit their stories to accomodate such a request, and there's no accounting for every single individuals desired approach to a game - it stands to reason why silent protagonists have been so popular for so long in gaming. How I play a game might wildly differ from the way you or someone else wants to play. As I said, I'm more than happy to make any requested edits to what I've written so far, but I feel the final say lies with Daisy and the design team as to how they want the players persona to be represented in action and dialog. I figure since it's a game, you just kind of have to suspend disbelief a bit and roll with it. Speaking from the standpoint of the quest I've written, mouthing off and acting like a total ass in the presence of royalty and his 30 armed guards doesn't exactly seem like the most intelligent thing to do. On the other hand, being given some magic orgasm remote that you can use at your discretion might allow for a bit more madness to creep into the story since you don't have a load of guards breathing down your neck with weapons drawn. I did try to allow for a bit of seediness in my quest so it wasn't such a stuck up affair of blindly accepting whatever comes your way by allowing the character to proposition the Emissary for sex, if only to further personal goals. Also, while the character may smile and nod, playing nice to the nobleman in his home, it's a different story when you can return later and try to nail his wife. By no means does that equate cackling madness, but it also doesn't turn the character into a whimpering chump who simply goes where the story pushes him. Hopefully, it allows a bit more choice in your actions. It's a great idea to be sure, but I think opening up parts of the game such as writing to the community is going to have to allow some variance in each writers style. At the end of the day, if Daisy and the team feels there's too much sway in the dialog between the submitted stories that creates some sort of intensely bi-polar character, they'll do the right thing to bring the dialog back in line to a more suitable level. They've got final say and I'm sure they'll exercise it. For what it's worth, I just appreciate the chance to add to a game that I've found enjoyable to play. If I weren't a flashtard and had some skill with programming, I'd happily help in that field. Unfortunately, I don't, so writing seemed like a good opportunity to help out. I do see your point, though.
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Post by darkbringer on Mar 3, 2011 16:59:29 GMT -5
mrxYeah I'm certainly not pushing for ridiculous amounts of options since as you said: WAY too much work and coordination needed at this time. I was thinking say 3 choices: good (a more noble/respectful tone), bad (a darker, more controlling type), neutral (Just advance the story). Just an example mind you, the actual way it's handled is obviously up to writers like yourself and Daisy's final word. Not to mention this current suggestion falls apart if there's only going to be 2 options for (all) dialogue trees anyway. I should say that the goal for this suggestion is to cut down on future inconsistencies and to start the thought process going for things like this. Keep up the good work, I really enjoyed reading both quests and I hope you come up with more.
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Post by irrbloss on Mar 3, 2011 17:03:45 GMT -5
Consistent writing typically happens during the editing process. I'm sure the author can be asked to alter this bit here or flesh out that bit there when and if the piece is accepted (peer-review). Dialogue wheels are evil.
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Post by missinglynx on Mar 3, 2011 17:15:15 GMT -5
Maybe the best thing to do here would be to not have dialogue, in the old fashioned traditional RPG way of doing things. You have an 'accept' or 'decline' option but other than that you're entirely mute. It would certainly help with the suspension of disbelief and it would also mean that players aren't 'forced' to be evil or good or Canadian or whatever the original writer decided upon for the story to progress, and it skips the issue of dialogue trees or wheels entirely.
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